[liberationtech] Not another Haystack right?

Tue Nov 29 15:58:17 PST 2011

Katrin,

First off, while this debate may not be pertinent *to this
thread*(admittedly, I only brought it up because I misunderstood
Brian's
comments), I do think it's a useful discussion to have, as many tool
developers don't seem to think about the impact of their funding on users.

Now, facts: I've been publicly critical of USG (and specifically,
State/DRL) funding since I worked at Berkman, so I'm not sure what kind of
"gotcha" you're trying to pull here.  Berkman incubated Global Voices (but
did not receive USG funding for it, nor has GV ever received USG money to
my knowledge), and Berkman received USG funding for *research*.  I don't
see what either of those facts have to do with USG funding of *tools* *or
trainings*, both of which have direct impact on individuals (whereas
research does not, though of course impact may be indirect).

To be clear, I'm not wholly opposed to USG funding.  There are obvious
pluses and minuses, but speaking narrowly, if we take circumvention as a
singular example, it's extremely clear that USG has in the past and perhaps
continues to fund tools that are not vetted, not secure, and not safe.  Add
to that the fact that some folks in MENA, and likely elsewhere, don't trust
the USG, tool developers would be well-advised to tread with caution.

You may think this debate is off the mark, and again, it is clearly not
relevant to the original thread (and for that I apologize).  But given that
it's at the top of the list for discussion at *every single Arab
blogging-type event I've ever been to*, I don't think you're in a place to
call it irrelevant.

Best,
Jillian

On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 3:02 PM, Katrin Verclas <katrin at mobileactive.org>wrote:

> Eh, Jillian - it's not that your former employer, the Berkman Center, ever
> received USG funding or supported a bloggers network...oh wait...
>
> I think this debate is really off the mark, unhelpful and needlessly
> ideologically narrow as well as playing into all sorts of conspiracy
> theories.  In the end, the ethics, quality of the work and the transparent
> conduct and legitimacy of the organization and any local partners speaks
> far louder than where the funding comes from.  And yes, speaking as a USG
> grantee who treads very carefully to make sure that our work and conduct
> speaks for itself in the end.
>
> Now, go ahead and beat on me as y'all are want to do ... :)
>
> Katrin
>
> On Nov 29, 2011, at 2:16 PM, Jillian C. York wrote:
>
> > I'm desperately curious as to why anyone thinks that USG funding makes
> something somehow more valid in the eyes of the tool's recipients/users.
>  "Viability" perhaps, but validity?  Surely you don't believe that.
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 10:53 AM, Michael Rogers <m-- at gmx.com> wrote:
> > Hi Brian,
> >
> > Thanks for the questions - answers below.
> >
> > On 29/11/11 18:22, Brian Conley wrote:
> > > 1. what are some use-cases you see for Briar? That is not clear from
> > > your site, other than "Briar is a secure news and discussion
> > > system designed to be used by journalists, activists and civil society
> > > groups in authoritarian countries. "
> > >
> > > How would they use it? What would they do with it? What are their
> goals,
> > > and for what reasons would they choose Briar over, say, secret Facebook
> > > groups run over TOR and HTTPS (there may be lots of problems with that
> > > example, its just an example that I think activists are likely to
> > > utilize, and I know of at least one case where a "secret facebook
> group"
> > > has been used to coordinate actions in an Arab country, though I doubt
> > > they were using any additional security in most cases)
> >
> > I hope people will use Briar for anything they currently use blogs,
> > mailing lists, Facebook groups and private emails for. But since it's
> > inconvenient to adopt new tools, I'd imagine its main appeal will be to
> > users who feel they're at risk of surveillance or censorship.
> >
> > When compared to Facebook, the advantages of Briar would include:
> > * Messages can be posted anonymously or pseudonymously
> > * Facebook and its partners don't have access to private messages
> > * Users in the same country don't need to "climb the wall" to
> > communicate with each other
> >
> > Of course, there are disadvantages too - not least of which is that
> > Facebook can be accessed from any computer with a browser.
> >
> > > With regard to its use by journalists especially, how will sources be
> > > able to be identified? Although you may not want people to know that
> > > Brian Joel Conley who lives in Portland OR, etc said X, Y, and Z, a
> > > journalist will need to know that X, Y, and Z were all said by the same
> > > source, among other needs.
> >
> > If someone needs to prove that two or more messages come from the same
> > source, she can sign those messages with a pseudonym. The pseudonym
> > doesn't need to be connected to her real identity in any way, and she
> > can use multiple pseudonyms without anyone, including her trusted
> > contacts, being certain that those pseudonyms belong to her.
> >
> > If someone needs to confirm that a pseudonym belongs to a specific
> > individual, she has to meet that individual face-to-face. Briar has
> > nothing equivalent to PGP's web of trust that could be used to attest
> > that "key X belongs to person Y according to person Z".
> >
> > > 2. who is funding your project? Are you being public about this? If
> not,
> > > it raises some concerns for the validity and viability of the project,
> > > though it may also be understandable given the subject matter. If it's
> > > not being funded by the Broadcast Board of Governors already, and
> you're
> > > willing to consider USG funding, let me know and I'm happy to put you
> in
> > > touch with some folks who may be able to assist.
> >
> > Thanks, that would be fantastic! The project has previously been funded
> > by the Small Media Initiative but isn't currently receiving any funding.
> > If we do, we'll be transparent about it.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Michael
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> > --
> > jilliancyork.com | @jilliancyork | tel: +1-857-891-4244 | google voice:
> +1-415-562-JILL
> >
> >
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>
> Katrin Verclas
> MobileActive.org
> katrin at mobileactive.org
>
> skype/twitter: katrinskaya
> (347) 281-7191
>
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> http://mobilemediatoolkit.org. To "Making Media Mobile!"
>
> A global network of people using mobile technology for social impact
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>
>

-- 
jilliancyork.com | @jilliancyork | tel: +1-857-891-4244 | google voice:
+1-415-562-JILL
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